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Arthur Q3: Women
Men are the main actors in both these stories, but the women aren't entirely missing. What do you think of the female characters? Do they agency and an effect on the plot? How are women portrayed in these stories? In Yvain, how do Laudine (Yvain's wife) and Lunete (her servant) compare? How about Guinevere?
Comments
Notable, perhaps, is the absence of witches (evil ones, I mean). Did they come to popularity in fiction later?
I found all the female characters far more interesting than the men.
Again the women who are most highly praised in the narrative are those who don't try to attain power or position but uphold their superiors. I did find it entertaining that every single woman who appears for more than a sentence is described as fabulously beautiful and without peer. So there's definitely a kind of almost deification of women, but as @Apocryphal says without a contrasting demonisation of other women as witches or scheming /malevolent. Think of how Morgan le Fay and Morgause are presented in the later Arthurian tales - they or those like them don't seem to be here. Maybe all those men riding around in trackless wastes for months and years got so desperate for the sight of a woman that whoever appeared seemed to them to be incomparably beautiful!
@RichardAbbott I also wondered if the beauty of the women was sort of the "returning soldier" or "just got out of prison effect" where the lack of any options for a long time made them find their options instantly much more appealing when they were presented to them. More likely it was just a narrative flourish, but it did cross my mind.
I also agree with @clash_bowley that the women were more interesting to me. They seemed to have a bit more agency and power than I would have expected going into this (though of course filtered through the lens of the time). Lunete's ability to to navigate the situations between Yvain and Laudine (even though it nearly cost her her life) was great
I agree the women were more interesting characters than the men. I think that was because of social roles being more rigid around men: there's really only one way for a man to be both good and manly. The women have fewer restrictions, and the lower-status women (such as Lunete) have even fewer restrictions.
At the same time, Lunete's loyalty to her patron was as strong as any man's devotion to honour.
This is a common plot in older fiction (and probably based in fact to a degree at least) - the attendants, maids or whatever of elite women are typically wholly committed and faithful, leaving indiscretions and such like unreported to the ruling men. Like the nurse in Romeo and Juliette. Presumably both elite and servant women knew that they had comparatively little overt social agency, so built their own world of covert power and influence.
Interesting discussions all round, everyone!